I can understand a slight mark-up for them being "official" speed holds, but $80 per hold is just ridiculous.
IFSC speed climbing holds
(47 posts) (19 voices)-
Posted 1 year ago #
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Come to Europe, and try to order US holds, you'll see the price you get after transportation and taxes.
The thing is that HRT holds are produced in europe, that really steps up the prices.
Life in Europe is a bit more expensive every thing you see that costs $50 will cost over €50 euros, right here we are being stolen.
For the size of the handhold 56€ is expensive but not ridiculous. I think the major problem here is not to have a licensed manufacture pouring in US, that would drop the price down a bit.
Again I think even if the holds would cost 200$ as a standpoint no one should copy them, I think is a matter of ethics that anyone who is on any creative field should embrace and respect.Posted 1 year ago # -
The holds are obviously expensive, that is an issue, licensing is obviously the way to go.
Re-shaping and producing a hold is like if an American musician heard some awesome song written and produced by a european, and was like "oh thats awesome and since they don't live here, and since they charge a lot for there album I am going to do an exact replica and perform it".
Its plagiarism...
Contact Jacky Godoffe and get the go ahead.
Posted 1 year ago # -
yeah, cuz jacky has anything to do with it.
the holds contact is making are not copies of the speed holds. they have not made a direct copy. so no plagiarism.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Plagiarism doesn't need to be a direct copy but to copy some elements of the idea.
Plagiarism is not the problem here cause its arguable were's the border between originality and plagiarism. The real problem here is piracy, and you probably agree that if the hold is part of a closed system that is supposed to uniformize speed climbing, if these holds are no equal to the originals they have no function, so probably they will be really damn close to the originals.Posted 1 year ago # -
Ya no body here speed climbs, or has an interest in speed climbing, I don't really care, i just think someone should get consent before they copy something.
even just out of basic life ethics...
Anyway, obviously contact has made a decision, and if they honestly feel that its the right thing to do then i support them.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Out of curiosity, has anyone tried to talk to folks at HRT or the IFSC about this issue, to see if it can be resolved without the risk of legal (intellectual property) fallout?
Posted 1 year ago # -
I have... OH WAIT .. that wasn't HRT it was Bendcrete.. .but a similar thing still
... the short story...I was contacted by a gym owner who had been trying for quite some time to get the "official dyno holds". The issue at hand was not cost, but the fact that he simply couldn't get a hold of anybody over there about getting the holds. So... He asked if I could make some similar holds as they really wanted to train on them.
I looked into it. I tried to contact some people about getting the holds, licensing, etc. etc. No luck at all. No calls or email returned ever. I tried to find any information about the holds I could... almost nothing available. I couldn't even find good pictures of them. I did find some sketchy documents after some creative searching, http://www.bendcrete.com/dynocomp/ but still nothing that helped us at all.
After all that we basically just said the heck with it.Seems to me that if there is an official hold of any kind, they should at least have some standards by which other manufacturers could make something at least similar for people to train on.
We've got official; basketballs, golf balls, baseballs, disc golf discs, etc. all made by different companies right?
Why not speed and dyno holds?
Posted 1 year ago # -
btw.. that story is almost 2 years old so things may (or may not) have changed since then as far as all that goes... ...
Posted 1 year ago # -
Foamdust, any word on those holds that were poured??? Pictures?
Posted 1 year ago # -
Posted 1 year ago #
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I want the Rolex! BALLIN!
Posted 1 year ago # -
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Posted 1 year ago # -
http://www.epusa.com/store/handholds.html (keep clicking more at the bottom of the page to get to it)
Im digging this up again, because the sleeping giants over at EP have what you want, you just didnt know it until you started trolling their website!
Seems I got a lot of emails about whether or not I had shaped the speed climbing hold for any company, and the answer is no. Sorry to disappoint but here they are regardless.
Posted 1 year ago # -
also see pages 3 and 9 of:
http://www.ifsc-climbing.org/2011/PA2011/Slides_PA2011/Speed_Portfolio_2011.pdfProduction and commercialization of holds will be subject to a License valid for one year.
Posted 1 year ago # -
I think 78 bucks is a little high for these holds don't you think? That would take 75% of our hold budget to get enough to set some thing close to the route for our kids to train on.
Posted 1 year ago # -
Posted 1 year ago #
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lol
Posted 1 year ago # -
I work in HRT, and even if it is a little late, I will anyway write our view on the topic, at least because a lot of mud was thrown at us – quite unjustly I think ...
several things:
- HRT is not listed as a partner of IFSC because HRT is the holds brand of Walltopia climbing walls, and Walltopia is listed.
- The speed holds turned out to be so expensive when delivered to USA- mainly because of the transport costs. When you ship a small cargo by courier from Europe to USA it is pretty expensive indeed, but after all it is not our fault that there isn't any company in USA manufacturing them.
- HRT is only one of the companies that is licensed to manufacture the speed holds, and anyone is free to buy them from any other supplier.
- Generally the big speed hold is pretty big as size by itself, and that is the main reason for its price, that obviously some people find very expensive
The HRT big speed climbing hold is manufactured from a very strong polyurethane resin by the COMPOZIT technology- I.e.- the resin is mixed with fiberglass and the hold has hollow back. The above 2 things make the hold extremely strong and very very light for its size, which on its side makes it much more easy to route-set with.
This technology is pretty expensive and is yet NOT copied by any other hold manufacturer.
- as far as unlicensed copying of the speed holds is concerned – I guess anybody can decide for himself whether to do it or not, and to take his responsibility.
- And finally – we have just sent a shipment of speed holds to our representative in USA_ Walltopia USA – travis@walltopia.com – tel. 1 916 290 2712 , and I suppose it will be much more easy and cheap to get them nowPosted 1 year ago # -
IFSC Speedholds are available at http://www.epusa.com NOW.
Posted 1 year ago #
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